AP 1190: How Do I Get Social Media Followers to Listen to My Podcast!?

Pat Flynn:
What's up everybody? Pat Flynn here and welcome to episode 1,190 of AskPat 2.0. You're about to listen to a coaching call between myself and an entrepreneur just like you, and today we're talking with Gillian from Sober Powered. Gillian Tietz is an amazing person who's helping loads of people through her podcast and her Facebook group and her Instagram, however, she's having a little bit of trouble connecting all of these pieces together. Namely her large following on Instagram and Facebook, they don't know her podcast exists or are not convinced enough to click play yet. That's what we're going to talk about today, how do we reduce the friction from social media and those places, to our podcast and get more listeners? Because she knows that when people listen to her show, it's changing lives.

First of all, before we get into it, just Gillian, thank you for what you're doing, stepping up, being vulnerable and sharing your own story to help others, and through what you're doing and the research that you're understanding and discovering, you amplifying that to others is making a difference. Thank you, and it's just an amazing example of somebody who has gone through some stuff, who has found a solution, and is learning as much as they can and now wants to pass it forward. This is exactly why I do what I do, and why everybody out there in the world who is helpful wants to do what they do, and this is a prime example. Gillian, follow her podcast. Sober Powered is the name, and here she is.

Gillian, thank you so much for coming on to AskPat. Welcome in. How are you?

Gillian Tietz:
I'm good. Thank you for having me.

Pat:
I also notice here, people can't see this, but I do notice that you have a Shure SM7B microphone, which is a really, really good microphone. I'm assuming you're a podcaster or do some broadcasting of some kind?

Gillian:
Yeah, I'm a podcaster. This was a gift to myself when it started getting popular.

Pat:
It is a really good gift, and that's the same microphone Joe Rogan actually uses on his show. Anyway, I'm here to help you, I'm excited about it, but if you could tell us a little bit about what you do and we'll go from there.

Gillian:
I am sober, and a big part of my drinking story was hating myself and feeling like it was all my fault because that's what everybody believes, it's a choice and it's moral failing and all of that. I really believed that there was something wrong with me, I was a bad person, all of that, and when I finally accepted that I can never drink ever again, I wanted to understand is it actually my fault? Am I actually a loser?

I work as a biochemist during the day, and I have a master's degree, and a main part of my job is reading papers and learning new things that I can apply to what we do. I'm very comfortable doing that, so I just applied that to drinking. I started researching addiction science right away, and it just became an everyday hobby to learn more. Then one day, eight months in, I woke up and I was like I need to tell everybody about this. This would help so many other people because it's helped me so much. I decided the best way to do that was by podcasting, which I didn't know how to do, so I actually Zoom-called myself because I didn't know how to record. I had no idea, and I was very impatient, so I launched the same day. I didn't have any listeners except myself, and in the past 10 months of podcasting, I've grown my show to about 12,000 downloads per month.

Pat:
Wow.

Gillian:
I have a sponsor.

Pat:
Are you kidding me? That is amazing. That, in and of itself, outside of the importance of that topic, you figuring this out, needing to get that message out there and now 12,000 downloads, a sponsor, congratulations. That's epic. Well done.

Gillian:
Thank you.

Pat:
This podcast, tell me about the podcast and what it is to you now and how it helps others.

Gillian:
It's just me talking. It's pretty time consuming because the level of research that goes into each episode. I will usually talk about a few different studies, so I read a lot before I create the episode. I've had a couple guests, but not many. Yeah, and I just try to explain what you're dealing with as a drinker. One common thing is anxiety. People will drink to relax or to help their anxiety, but alcohol actually, when you abuse it, changes your brain chemistry to then cause anxiety. I will explain things like that. It doesn't actually help; it causes your problem. Yeah, I love it. I'm close to 50 episodes now.

Pat:
That's so amazing. Well, congratulations, and I think you're doing such a huge service to others who are going through some stuff in their life and they're drinking, and they don't know what's going on. By you stepping up and stepping forward to do a lot of the research that a lot of others probably either just don't have the time to do, don't have the energy or even the want to do it, but they just want to hear it from somebody who's been in their shoes once before, that's life changing. Have you gotten anybody to reach out to you as a listening to your show and what has that been like?

Gillian:
A lot. I get a lot of DMs or emails. People will tell me that it's the thing that has helped them actually quit and stay sober. People will write me they were struggling, they were kind of sober, and now they listen to my show every day. Some people listen to the same episode multiple times and then it just helps them maintain their positive attitude towards sobriety.

Pat:
I think everybody listening is wanting to know what the name of the show is in case they might be struggling through something or might know somebody. What's the name of the show? Where can we find it?

Gillian:
Yeah, it's called Sober Powered.

Pat:
Sober Powered. That is actually a really good title, by the way. I like that. What's going on? Things seem to be moving along. How can I best serve you today?

Gillian:
The biggest issue that I encounter is getting people off of social media to listen to my show. I have a Facebook group with, I think we're nearing a thousand members, and my Instagram, I have 6,000 followers and I don't have 6,000 listeners. People will like my content, they'll respond to it, DM me about it, and they won't go listen to the show, which is basically just what I post about anyways.

I had someone DM me a couple days ago and she said, "I finally started listening to it and it's the most helpful sobriety podcast in my life. I've already listened to five episodes." I looked and she had DMed six months ago, so she's been following me and enjoying my stuff for six months before she gave the show a chance.

Pat:
Wow.

Gillian:
I'm wondering, how can I lower the barrier to people liking me and liking what I have to say, to then go listen to a 15-minute show?

Pat:
Yeah, that's a great question, and that's a really interesting thing. How are they finding you initially do you think, before they listen to the podcast? How are they getting access to you first before they listen to the show?

Gillian:
Yeah. A lot of people will discover me on Instagram. Other pages will share my story. I've guested on a ton of different podcasts and maybe just using the hashtags too, because every month I get to post a “soberversary” thing, and that always gets a lot of likes and new people. I think mainly Instagram.

Pat:
Okay. That makes sense. It can work both ways, right? A lot of people may discover you first on your podcast then join you on social. First of all, we want people to listen to the show obviously, but the fact that they're in your community in a way that is inserting into their life in the way that they can is also a win. The fact that people are finding you on Instagram and getting involved in the fact that a person had been in your community for six months before listening, we want them to listen sooner, but you should also be proud of the fact that you are now growing beyond the podcast. You have this community now, which is incredible, and the support system for not just you, but for them and each other, and that's really great. That's an end goal for a lot of podcasters, a lot of people who have businesses, and you have that, which is great.

But more tactically, first of all, I would recommend that you pay attention to Shawn Stevenson. I don't know if you know who Shawn Stevenson is. He's a podcaster. Very similar vibe to you as far as, "Hey, let me do the research and I will share the research with you."

He is a podcaster, very proficient, and he'll, on his Instagram especially, and I think I would just follow him on Instagram to see how he does what he does, he does a really good job of having people follow him there and then come listen to the show. He shows clips of the show. I don't know if you've done that yet, but shared maybe one-minute video or one-minute audio file of a clip of the show that's really, really easy to consume. Because when we think about it, people on social media aren't on social media to go and to go away from social media and listen for 15 minutes. It's a big ask. I like the idea of something small and easily consumable, like most other social media things, to then get people excited about listening in. We need something easy. A quick win that could get them excited. That's number one, and Sean does that really well.

Shawn Stevenson is his name. I think his Instagram is @shawnmodel because he has a podcast called The Model Health Show, and not model like for models, but model like let me be the model or let me share the ideal model of what it is to be healthy. Actually, you two would be pretty good to collaborate with each other, interestingly enough. I'll see if I can introduce you, actually.

In addition, I think that if you provide a way to have people realize that others in the group are listening to the show, they might be incentivized or encouraged, because of the group mentality, to also listen to that show. As opposed to just like, "Hey, this week on the podcast we talked about this," because that in and of itself, just the topic and people's discussion is value, you could say, "Hey. Who here listened to the really important message I shared in this conversation today, and what was your biggest takeaway from it?" Now people are talking, they're like, "Oh, that was amazing," and then that could encourage others to go, "Wait, what? What are y'all talking about? I feel like I'm missing out." You could have people feel FOMO a little bit to go and listen to your show because other people who are on the inside are talking about it, right? That could help encourage people to go, "Okay, I've got to listen to this thing because everybody here is talking about it." That could be really interesting.

Another way to go about it would be, I guess this is step three or option three or number three, would be to have a really good, clear starting episode. A big issue with a lot of content creators across the board, podcasters, video, blogging is like, "Hey, here's my stuff," and then they go there and they're just like, "Ah, there's so much to consume. Where do I even begin?" It doesn't have to be episode one. It could be episode 50 or whatever. "Hey, episode 50, this is going to be the flagship number one episode you should listen to. It's where you need to start. If you've listened to this already, this will be a nice reminder for you, but if you're just starting out, this is the place to start." Everywhere you go, on every social media, it's like, "Hey, by the way, if you're just getting started," or maybe you have a DM with somebody, "Hey listen to episode 50. This is where you're going to want to start."

That way, all the other episodes don't matter. Start there, because like you said, this person listened to one episode and then they're like, "Okay, now I'm hooked." This could be a strategy for okay, if you were to pick one episode, this is the one, and then that's the one you're always talking about. I've done that several times. Right now it's episode 192, 193 and 194 on Smart Passive Income Podcast for how to start making passive income, and it's weird that it's like, “Okay, start with 192,” but you just say it and people go and they follow your direction, so that could help.

Then finally—and then I'll let you talk, I promise; I'm just spitting everything out at you right now—but option four would be to who have a little contest or something, where maybe they get a 15-minute chat with you or you do a giveaway of any kind. In order for them to get access to the giveaway, they have to listen to the instructions in the podcast episode, right? That could go, "Okay, well if there was a time to listen," it's, "I want that thing," or, "That sounds fun. Okay, fine. I'll put down social media and listen to this."

You could even encourage people on top of that. I guess this is 4.5, to listen while they're on their walk or at the gym. People don't realize, especially those who don't really normally listen to podcasts, they don't really realize just how awesome it is to just fit it into your drive or fit it into a walk. You can probably post on Facebook, like, "Hey. Everybody here who listens to the podcast, where do you listen to my show? I'd love to know." That could just be really, a) interesting for you to find out, but b) it could encourage others to go, "Oh snap. Wait. First of all, there are a lot of people here who listen to the show, and oh, I never had that thought that I could just listen while taking my dog out on a walk. Okay, I'm going to go do that." That could be a neat, small thing that you could try too. I hope this helps. Any of those stand out to you or any response to that?

Gillian:
The last one, that makes me think of my Facebook group because sometimes someone will post something and then another member will recommend some particular episode, and they'll be like, "Oh, I didn't even know that there was a podcast." But the group is called Sober Powered, and the podcast...

Pat:
I mean, that’s kind of funny. Again, it's just a testament to just how great the community is, right? The fact that they don't even know a show's there. We want them to know, but the fact that they're sticking around is awesome. That's really cool.

Gillian:
Yeah. I've tried to make my group and my Instagram page like I'm a person and you don't have to ever listen if you don't want to, to benefit from my page. I don't just talk about podcast stuff. I talk about my life and my struggles and whatever, but I do want them all to listen to the podcast.

Pat:
Here's another thing that just came to mind, because if I was in a community and I was like, "I guess I'm not super interested in listening because I get everything I need here," something that would make me want to click play, though, would be if a friend that I made in the community was featured on the show, and I was like, "Oh my gosh. I have to listen to this.” Because it's not about necessarily you Gillian, but it's you and the conversation with my buddy, and I want to hear the story fully. I got to know this person a little bit on DMS and online, but I want to hear her voice. I want to hear their story fully," and they're coming there for that person and that person who's a representative of the community. That can be a really neat way to encourage other community members to come on, to maybe even get to the point where they have a success that they could share with others and make them feel empowered. How does that sit with you?

Gillian:
Yeah, I like that idea, and I've had three guests. One of them was my husband, who's not drawing in a crowd, and the other two were members of the Sober community, and that did draw new people in because they were interested in hearing from them. I guess it's just hard. I'm very protective over my show. I have a lot of people reach out because they see the numbers and they're like, "Oh, I want to come on your show and share my story," and I don't know, it's very hard for me to...

Pat:
You don't want them to take over, and not that they would take over, but you don't want it to take away from the deep research that you're doing and stuff, right? Am I thinking about that correctly?

Gillian:
Yeah. It's hard. I've had someone come on and talk about AA because I've never gone, so I can't talk about it, and I had another person come on and talk about parenting. I'm not a parent. So I try to find people that have something that I cannot contribute. I really like to get to know them, and I'm just very picky and it's hard for me. I'm so protective of my show.

Pat:
No, that makes sense. One thing you could do to maybe consolidate all that, because I can imagine if you do that once a month, that's still 12 episodes to offer, if you will. You could potentially have an episode a quarter or one every six months that invites not just one community member, but maybe it's a special milestone episode to celebrate wins, and you have everybody who comes on to share a big sober-related win that they've had, in their own voice. And whether you have a conversation with them, to have that conversation and have that be interesting, or maybe they just record an audio file telling their quick story, you hear them encourage others who are listening. Then you have 10 people in one episode, that becomes a huge reason for me, as a community member, to go and listen because I get to hear from multiple people. I get encouraged along the way, and you only have to, quote-unquote, give up that one episode if you will, versus a whole bunch or an entire episode where it might get involved with, or it might get in the way of the deeper research and stuff.

Gillian:
I like that idea a lot, actually. And I'm already thinking about people that could ask.

Pat:
Oh, cool.

Gillian:
I think if I pick a really cool topic, yeah, and then just have people call in and record something and then make... You were talking about this somewhere. Maybe it was in your office hours. I can't remember, but how you made one episode and I think you had 10 people record an audio, and you just put it together. Yeah, so something like that.

Pat:
I think so. That would be cool. The tool I was using was SpeakPipe.com. SpeakPipe. You could also collect these on like Google Voice or something if you wanted to. But yeah, that's a really cool thing. I like your idea to—we're just riffing now, it's cool—like your idea of a special topic or something. Maybe one is like, "Hey. Everybody here today is going to share the one person in their journey to sobriety that has helped them the most. It could be a family member, it could be a friend, and you're going to discover that there's all different kinds of ways to get support out there. Whether it's here in the community or out there in the world, there are people out there who want to help you. So here's Jane telling her story." Next, you pop in, maybe with a little research and something in between, and then Tim comes in with his story, and then you pop in with some more of your knowledge on top of that. And you become the glue that puts all these pieces together. It becomes an incredibly powerful and probably very emotional episode.

And again, to your question, which is how do I get people to listen? That's going to get me to listen, I think, more than maybe something that is more science based that may not pique my interest as much, but this is the gateway, right? The gateway into the show.

Gillian:
Yeah, that's a really good idea. And then that could be my flagship episode.

Pat:
There you go! Yo, that's great. I like we're combining all the things here. That's really cool. Do you have some things you could take from this episode and move on and move forward with?

Gillian:
I think I could even ask people what's the most impactful thing you've learned throughout your whole journey? And then, whatever someone says, I could talk in the... I like talking in the middle instead of just splicing it all together. I think that gives it more fluidity. But yeah, that's a good idea because I have some topics, like when I talk about sugar cravings or weight loss, that brings in a lot of new people because they're like, "Oh, sugar. I need to..." It's just very clickbait, but yeah, I can't do clickbait every single time, so having something big like this, and I could even like tease it and maybe get my email list involved in some way.

Pat:
And it's a celebration, right? You can bring the community together. It's more than just the podcast, right? It's the entire thing.

On that topic of clickbait, it's interesting because on YouTube it's even more important because you're fighting against so many other people and other attentions. I found that clickbait is only bad if you tell people one thing and then you don't deliver on that promise. You kind of have to be a little clickbaity in ways, and you don't have to do it every time, but you have to, to capture attention and to get people to click, because that becomes then the way that you can start to serve them. And you can have the best information in the world, but unless you capture their attention up front, then you might as well not even have it. So I like that you're doing that, but then not all the time, so there's a mix. Hopefully these things can help bring more people in and keep them around it because it sounds like once people start listening, they're in, so that's your task.

Gillian:
Yeah. I think I have a lot to work on and brainstorm.

Pat:
Good. This has been super great, Gillian. One more time, where can people listen to the show or go and find you? Anything else you want to shout out, feel free.

Gillian:
Yeah, so my show is called Sober Powered. That's my Instagram, website, Facebook group. Very simple.

Pat:
Awesome. Everybody listening, go check out Sober Powered. Gillian, thank you so much for your time today, and best of luck. Do you mind if we maybe reach back out to you again in the future to see how things go and what you do and how it all turns out?

Gillian:
Yeah. I would love that, and it's very motivating.

Pat:
Good, good. A little bit of accountability, I guess.

All right. I hope you enjoyed that coaching call with Gillian Tietz. Again, you can find her at Sober Powered on Apple Podcasts and follow her on Instagram and her Facebook group. And wow, just Gillian, thank you so much, and congrats on the continued growth. At the time of this recording, your Instagram has grown about two and a half thousand since you mentioned it on the show when we recorded it, so you're going even faster now. And I also know you have an amazing YouTube channel where you show up fully, just like you do on your podcast, reaching new audiences. You can follow her on YouTube as well: Sober Powered.

Anyway, thank you so much. Make sure you hit subscribe so you don't miss next week's episode where we're going to invite somebody else on who we can coach, and you could be that fly on the wall and hopefully get some information and inspiration to help you in your business too. Thank you so much, and make sure to check out AskPat.com if you want to fill out an application to potentially be coached just like Gillian did today.

Anyway, thanks so much. Peace out, take care, and I'll see you in the next one. Team Flynn for the win.

Thanks for listening to AskPat at AskPat.com. I'm your host, Pat Flynn. Our senior producer is Sara Jane Hess, our series producer is David Grabowski, and our executive producer is Matt Gartland. Sound editing by Duncan Brown. AskPat is a production of SPI Media. We'll catch you in the next session.