Hey everybody, you can sell and serve at the same time. On this episode of AskPat 2.0, I talk with Colette Kent, who teaches Ayurveda (a system of medicine with historical roots in the Indian subcontinent). She tells me that in the ancient days, Ayurvedic doctors would only get paid if they had no patients. How's THAT for a business model? It's making it hard for her to settle on appropriate marketing. She asks, “How can sell authentically, without overwhelming my audience?” Together, we come up with a really amazing opportunity for her to connect deeper with her audience and sell and serve at the same time.
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Pat Flynn: What's up everybody? Pat Flynn here and welcome to episode 1108 of AskPat 2.0. This is a coaching call between myself and an entrepreneur just like you. And today we're speaking with Colette. She is a health and mind and body restorer, if you will. She teaches something called Ayurveda. And her struggle is, she has this great business, but her struggle is she doesn't want to market and come across too salesy. She doesn't want to overwhelm her audience with just overselling. And if you have any care for your audience, you likely have felt this before—where you don't want to come across to somebody who's just doing it just for the money. It's important to make money so that you can help more people and make a living, but at the same time, how do you balance that versus just the sensitivity of your audience and wanting to help them versus needing to sell to them and just coming across authentically?
Pat: And so this is what we discussed today and if this is something that you've ever thought about yourself or if you're going to start a business that you're worried about, well then make sure you listen in because here's Colette. You can find her at elementshealingandwellbeing.com. Here we go.
Pat: Hey Colette, welcome to AskPat 2.0. Thanks so much for being here today.
Colette Kent: Pat. Thank you so much for this opportunity. I'm really happy to be here.
Pat: Yeah, I'm excited. So why don't you tell us really quick a little bit about yourself and what you do.
Colette: Okay. My name is Colette. I'm originally from Ireland. Spent some time in the States in the corporate world, needed to hop off the hamster wheel in my late 20s and got into my passion for health and fitness. And now I'm back in Europe and live in France, and I have an online business where I really help people restore balance in their body and mind and educate them and empower them on how to live in tune with their true natures so that they can connect with their true nature and thrive in life. So what I teach is Ayurveda, which is really like the manual to life that we never received.
Pat: Ayurveda, that sounds really cool. So how long have you been doing that for?
Colette: So I been doing this full time since about 2014.
Pat: 2014. Awesome. And where might people go to learn more about you really quick before we get started here?
Colette: Great. Thank you for that. My website is elementshealingandwellbeing.com.
Pat: Fantastic. Thank you. Well that sounds all really exciting. So tell us a little bit about what you might need help with. What's on your mind?
Colette: So my big issue is marketing. I have a podcast. I have my online products and services. And my big thing is marketing in a way that's authentic to me because I really don't want to overwhelm people or to inundate people with lots of marketing and lots of emails and so on. And I really have a hard time finding what's the best way for me to market.
Pat: Gotcha. Tell me what ultimately you're worried about it. If you were to worry people, what's the ultimate outcome that you're worried about?
Colette: That I'm sending out too much in newsletters or if I watched these launches where you really have to be communicating with people a lot and telling them about your services and your new course coming up and stuff. And I just feel that I don't want to overwhelm people.
Pat: In a perfect world, how would you get me... Let's say I'm in your target audience, how would that experience be a great experience for me to get into your products? Like walk me through number one, how I'm introduced to you. Maybe it's the podcast or something else, and then just kind of take me through my user story and how I eventually get into your products and get served by you.
Colette: Sure. Okay. So I do have my weekly podcast called Elements of Ayurveda, and that's a very educational show where it's for beginners and advanced students of Ayurveda. So it's all about educating the public on this ancient wisdom, ancient health wisdom. And in my course, I give a lot of calls to action or in my podcast, I should say, there's a lot of calls to action. And I also offer a 20 minute free online strategy call. So ideally a person could contact me through there, ask some questions, being of service, that's a free call. And then from there I, depending on what they need, then I would recommend some of my services or products for them. And that's the ideal way for me that they will resonate with my message and on my podcast and that all the information I provide and the education. And that they will have a connection, which is where I'm getting my clients now. And that they will have a connection with me and be like, "Okay, I could work with this person. I resonate with them." And then get a free call from there and then progress on.
Colette: So in Ayurveda, it's kind of a funny business model. Like back in the ancient days that the Ayurvedic doctor would only get paid if he or she had no patients. So it's like not a continuous business model. It's really about empowering and educating the person to the point that they don't need you anymore.
Pat: Wow, that's really interesting. So you're incentivized, if you will, to truly help people and, and kind of get them off your plate so you can help others and get them off your plate too. And everybody will be in a better status at that point. That's really interesting. So I can see how even just the ancient ways of marketing Ayurveda is something that you'd like to reflect in that you don't want to be there to just annoy and overwhelm and constantly just feel like you're always in selling mode versus... Yeah. Cool. Okay.
Pat: So everything I'm hearing so far is just of service to me, which was the first thing I was looking for. So in this experience, like everything that you're doing and all the decisions that you're making for me are out of service. And I think that's really the first thing I look for. The podcast is an amazing platform and amazing way for you to have people get to know you before they even start working with you. And I think having an interim sort of call as the main goal to get on with them, to have them learn about you even more, I mean that that's a huge offering just to have a free 20 minutes sort of consultation or call with you. How are you, I'm just curious, how are you managing the calls? Are you scheduling those in some tool or device to manage your time? Because that could potentially, especially as the podcast grows, lead to quite a lot of people sort of waiting to speak to you.
Colette: Sure. At first I kind of changed the description of the call before it was a "discovery" call, whereas now it's more of a "services inquiry" call. So the name of it has changed slightly in order to have people know that this is really, if you're... Now that I've produced enough two years of the podcast that you should have enough of a feeling about me that you know whether you want to work with me or not. And so now it's more of a services inquiry call rather than a discovery call. I had more time for discovery calls before, but now it's more that I really don't have time for people who have questions about whether they want to work with me and just ask some leading questions about is this right for them? And so right now I use Acuity for scheduling and right now I have time for them. It's fine right now that it's not causing a problem. Down the line I may have to make a decision that. If I find that I'm overwhelmed with them, then I may have to cut down the time and the availability I have for those free calls.
Pat: And then you came into this call asking for help with marketing. With what you're doing right now, where are things lacking? Are we not getting enough calls or where's the hole that we're trying to fill? Because it doesn't sound like you... It sounds like you have a great plan to convert people into students and clients of yours to serve them. It doesn't sound like you need to add a giant email sort of thing like you were worried about or these other marketing tactics. They might not be needed. So I'm just curious, where are things in the current system you have sort of lacking, do you feel?
Colette: Yeah, I would like to convert more people over into my... I have on like an online cleanse and a daily habits course, self-paced course and so on and just an in-depth consultation. I would like to be converting more people over. I feel like my newsletter subscribers are not where they want to be also. I feel like I could have more of those. I send out a weekly newsletter as well. And so I do feel like I could be converting a lot more.
Colette: The podcast is doing well in terms of numbers and so on, and I'm getting great reviews. So I don't know. I mean, like I said, it's two years old. I did my podcasting course with you, Pat. Thank you very much. And so I feel like it's growing and I don't know if it's a just a matter of time that I have to give it more time or is there more I should be doing? But again, I struggle with this really being out there so much, because this industry of Ayurveda and that it's more of this yes, in-service business and empowering education clients. So I don't want to be so out there in my marketing. Does that make sense?
Pat: Yeah, it does. Here's what I feel with the combination of things you have and the accessibility that you have with your audience already, here's where I really feel like you can excel. I think a lot of people have this opportunity. They just don't see it. And something that's been working well for me is doing just this. So it's pulling out the success stories that you've created already and using these assets. You have the podcast, maybe even within the conversations that you have, on your website, or even with an email telling these stories about your students, not about you. It's not selling. It's just sharing. Here's Jane, she had this problem and here's where she is now. And she just happened to use my cleansing product, and this is what I would like to offer for you too, if this sounds like you.
Pat: I love story marketing because it doesn't feel like marketing because it's not. It's storytelling with, "Oh my gosh, I am that person. I want those results too. I will do what she did. I'm going to get into Colette's course or into Colette's cleanse," or whatever it might be.
Pat: So where I got inspired to learn more about this was when I interviewed a guy named Stu McLaren. He's the membership guy. He has a program called Tribes, and I was interviewing him because I was very curious about membership sites versus courses, which I have. And I asked him a lot of questions, and every time I asked a question that was almost kind of like going against membership sites or a big objection I had, he had a story from one of his students just ready to counter my objection every single time.
Pat: And it was funny because when I interviewed... He was a guest speaker at my event FlynnCon, and I interviewed him on stage after his talk. And I told him that I was so impressed by how you just remembered all these stories and you have them like in your back pocket. Like how did you do that? And he's like, "Pat, I'm sorry. I'm going to tell you the secret. I have a spreadsheet behind my computer and when you were interviewing me, I just found the objection that you had. And I looked to the side and said, 'Okay, these are the stories I can tell that counter that objection.'" So he purposefully pulls these stories out and has them as his marketing tools. And to me, it didn't feel like marketing at all, but he was just helping me understand the objections that I had and how they were false.
Pat: And so I've adopted a lot of this. So when I sell my Podcasting Course, for example, one of the first things I talk about in my webinar is here are some of the objections that you might have in your head. You might think that you need a large audience to have a successful podcast. Well, meet Phil Lichtenberger who has this podcast about scanners. He's one of our students. And here's what he did. Here's where he's at now and he's doing really well.
Pat: So even in the webinar, I'm telling a story and I'm teaching. But I'm also selling my product at the same time. So you have these platforms already. You can invite a student onto your podcast to ask them what it was like before, what it was like after, and naturally your product will come out as a result. You can do the same thing in email. You can do the same thing everywhere. And if you just focus on the success stories and pulling those out and making your audience the hero of the story, not you. I mean, it doesn't feel like selling at all and it's a beautiful thing.
Colette: Yeah, I love that idea. And I recall that you did an episode like that where you brought three or four of your students on—kind of thing. Like where are they now?
Pat: Yeah, and it crushed. And I planned that specifically to come out the week that my podcast course was launching. And of course I interviewed podcasters who took my course, and I didn't ask them to come on my show and go, "Hey, tell me why my course was awesome." That wasn't it. Why did you start a podcast? What were you afraid of? What were you hoping would happen? And then what's life like now? And then I pulled out very specific types of people in my audience. So I pulled out a Dr. B who is over 60 years old, very, very afraid of technology—that represents a lot of my audience who wants to start a podcast, afraid of technology. And she said, "Oh my gosh, I did it. You made it so easy, Pat." And of course, what do people think now? "Oh my gosh, I was afraid of technology too, but if she could do it, maybe Pat can help me too." So you're right, that that's a very specific example from my archive. And I think that you could potentially do the same thing.
Pat: How does that feel to you in terms of if you were to start "marketing" more, but doing it in that way, how would that feel to you?
Colette: Yeah. I love that. I love it particularly when what resonates with me is when you say that I'm not in the spotlight, that I am bringing the spotlight more to my clients' journeys. And actually I did copy that episode when you did it because I love the idea, and I remember you saying how much of a success it was for you. So I did it last year and now I actually just.. I am lining up some people. I do kind of an end-of-year review. So I'm lining up some clients from different countries and that they can share their experience and stuff. And I think that is the loveliest way to do it. But also you made me think about maybe just dropping in some testimonials maybe into the podcast, getting approval for using client's testimonials and things like that. That maybe I can do it in other ways as well. And like you said in the newsletter.
Pat: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Oh absolutely. And if you were to do that on the podcast, for example, like at the end of an episode where it's like for five minutes, somebody else comes on and they're telling their story or maybe even your telling their story. "Hey, I want to tell you about Jane, and she was one of my students. She took this course, and I want to tell you about life was like for her before." And then you could paint that picture for them visually with your words, and then you can talk about what life is like after. And you can just go, "Hey, by the way, if this is a course that you're interested in, I'm offering a deal for it right now. And if that resonates with you, awesome. If not, no worries." And that way it's not like hit him hard until they finally buy, which I'm not in that camp either. I don't like that either.
Pat: So you have those assets already to be able to do that. I think that's great. And I would just lean into that. I mean, maybe you once a quarter invite a number of people onto your podcast who are students of yours. And this also becomes a cool way for your community to know that you're listening to them. You're paying attention to them. People love when somebody who's like them wins because it encourages them. But it also shows that you as a leader, you're paying attention to your people. And I think that speaks highly too.
Colette: Yeah, I love that idea. And to make it a regular thing, like you said, at the end of a quarter or something that they know, "Oh, I wonder who's going to be on the podcast this time."
Pat: Yeah, I like it. How are you feeling about this direction for marketing?
Colette: Yeah, it makes me feel much better because I think there's so much right out there and there's so many ideas, and you can get overwhelmed and almost just decision paralysis on where to go next.
Pat: There's so much stuff. Like, "Oh, let's do Facebook ads, and here's a webinar strategy. No, okay. Well, here's a three-day video series thing that you could do. And oh my gosh, like I'm just so overwhelmed now." No, let's make your students the hero of the story and put them everywhere so everybody else can see it. And that's just going to invite new people in.
Colette: Yeah. I love that. And it's so in line with what I'm teaching, and it seems more authentic too, this ancient wisdom. So yeah.
Pat: You have to ask for the sale though. That's the one thing that I think a lot of people who adopt this kind of strategy, miss—is you have to ask, but I think the ask becomes a lot easier when you set it up this way. And so don't forget the call to action to buy and the fact that that is coming from a place of service. And hopefully with these stories behind it, it could feel like that all around.
Colette: Yeah, exactly. Yes. Adding the call of action in at the end of the client's testimonial will be great and it'd be a lot easier then.
Pat: Yes, they were doing the selling for you.
Colette: Right. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. No, I love that idea. Sounds great. Thanks a million.
Pat: Yeah, absolutely. Do you mind if we perhaps check in with you down the road to see how it goes? Maybe later in the year, next year so we can kind of check up on you and hold you accountable to things?
Colette: I love it. Yeah. It would be my pleasure. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time.
Pat: Yeah, you're welcome, Colette. Good job. And one more time. Where can people go to learn more about you and what you got going on?
Colette: Oh, thank you. My website is elementshealingandwellbeing.com and then the podcast is Elements of Ayurveda.
Pat: Awesome. Thank you so much and we'll chat soon.
Colette: Cheers, Pat. Take care of yourself.
Pat: I hope you enjoyed that coaching call with Colette. Again, you can her at elementshealingandwellbeing.com. And if you want to look her up and learn more about what she does, Ayurveda is what it's called. And you can restore that balance in your mind and body. elementshealingandwellbeing.com.
Pat: Thank you so much for being here, Colette, and for being vulnerable and opening up. Obviously we came to a really amazing opportunity for you to connect deeper with your audience and sell and serve at the same time because that's something you can do. Everybody, you can sell and serve at the same time.
Pat: Thank you so much for listening and I appreciate you. Make sure you hit subscribe if you haven't already and as always, just I appreciate you, love you so much. Make sure you check out FlynnCon if you haven't yet done so, tickets are going fast. We're almost sold out. You can check it out FlynnCon F-L-Y-N-N-C-O-N.com. Come join me and hundreds of other amazing entrepreneurs who are there to all help each other, including you. Here in San Diego, July 16 -18. Tickets are available FlynnCon.
Pat: Cheers. Thanks so much. And as always, Team Flynn for the win. Peace.